Forum:Rest (to); Resting (to be)
Steeven, could you please give examples, where to use odpočivat and where odpočit I've been using odpočivat only so far... --Moraczewski 05:43, September 3, 2009 (UTC) Andrej, In Slovioski only - or with translations into English - to compare/contrast "to rest" versus "to be resting"? --Steevenusx 18:13, September 3, 2009 (UTC) Better to compare. How would you translate different English constructions. --Moraczewski 20:19, September 3, 2009 (UTC) ---- PRIKLADI - PRIMERI - EXAMPLES :*''We rest every day.'' :*'Mi odpočime (se) každij den.' ::...not resting all day; but at some time every day. (like on holiday/vacation) :*''We are resting every day.'' :*'Mi odpočivame (se) každij den.' ::...resting ALL day, every day - continuous rest. (like in a hospital) In English, the grammatical verbal difference are called: SIMPLE PRESENT - represents 'habitual'' actions (by habit) or periodic actions; but NOT action occurring all the time. PROGRESSIVE PRESENT - represents actions occurring continuously in the present. --Steevenusx 20:30, September 3, 2009 (UTC) Thank you. I think they should be used without se. But now I see a problem. As we set initially, Slovioski doesn't have verbal aspect. But actually later we presented the grammatical stuff to form perfective/imperfective verbs: by zu- and -va. So in the current grammar each verb can have two forms: like diskutat / diskutovat. These forms will be likely treated as perfective/imperfective by most readers. So Slavic-speaking users will use these verb forms as they are used to - as the aspect. Thus they will be used different way. The main difference is that Slavic perfective verbs CAN NOT have present tense (a perfective verb in present form is translated to English with Future Perfect Tense). In Slavic languages only Mi odpočivame každij den is possible in Present. So we have three options. :* 1. We introduce verb aspect :* 2. We abandon zu-'' and ''-va and leave only one verb :* 3. We introduce verb tenses that do not exist in Slavic languages (like Progressive Present) and give explanations to them. and these options have the following consequences: :* 1. it makes the language more complex :* 2. it requires some additional grammatical constructions to translate English Perfect Tenses. Note that Slavic languages that don't use aspect (South Slavic), they use complex Past Tenses (Past Imperfective, Past Perfective, Plus-Quam-Perfect and stuff). :* 3. we make the language foreign to Slavic people. These are my thoughts about that... Just logic, no Slovianski propaganda. --Moraczewski 03:26, September 4, 2009 (UTC) ---- The SIMPLE PRESENT and the PROGRESSIVE PRESENT have not presented any significant problems in our daily written commerce between Europe and the US. The Czech-speakers, however, seem much more "at home" (comfortable) using the PROGRESSIVE form of the verb than do the Serbo-Croatians. The Czechs say that the Czech language already uses this form - and not as for verbal aspect purposes. In fact, they have used the ''-va'' construction with both perfective and imperfective verbs. Let's take a look at some examples of this: :*I discuss the project with him. - (discussion at various times - today, tomorrow, next year) :*Ja disku''tam'' projekt s nim. :*I am discussing the project with him. - (discussion is taking place within some current time-frame) :*Ja diskut''ovam'' projekt s nim. :*I discussed the project with him. - (discussion took place in the past - the discussion has ended/terminated) :*Ja diskut''al'' projekt s nim. :*I was discussing the project with him. - (discussion took place in the past - but discussion has NOT ended yet) :*I used to discuss the project with him. - (discussion took place in the past - it may have ended, but could continue) .....................................................................(this is a difficult verb tense to equal in the Slavic languages) :*Ja diskut''oval'' projekt s nim. :*I will discuss the project with him. - (discussion will take place in the future, but WHEN we do not know) :*Ja budem diskutat projekt s nim. :*I will be discussing the project with him. (an ongoing progressive discussion will take place in the future) :*Ja budem diskut''ovat'' projekt s nim. :*I will discuss the project with him.'' - (discussion will DEFINITELY take place in the future) :*Ja zu''disku''tam projekt s nim. :*I will be discussing the project with him. - (an ongoing progressive discussion will DEFINITELY take place in the future) :*Ja zu''diskut''ovam projekt s nim THUS, I believe... :*We do NOT need to introduce verbal aspect other than zu-''' :*We should continue to use 'zu-' and '-va-' :*We can provide explanations of the Progressive Present Tense, however, the '''translation engines between English and Slovioski will handle the challenge; while the translation engines between a Slavic Language and Slovioski will select the SIMPLE PRESENT and the ''ZU-'' form of the verb and, perhaps, ignore the PROGRESSIVE PRESENT form altogether because it is not used in the SLAVICS. (I should ask to see whether our CZECHS and SERBS use the PROGRESSIVE form of verbs when they communicate between each other; however, this is not something that we track/follow and we do not keep emails very long in our computer systems - unless they are important emails, and then they are translated into English) --Steevenusx 05:00, September 4, 2009 (UTC)